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hsapiens
hsapiens
05 February 2008 @ 01:22 pm
Next round of primaries and making my own choice  
If you live in a Super Tuesday state and haven't already voted: please don't forget to go and vote!

For the first time since I started voting at age 18, I might cast a presidential ballot that counts -- assuming that the Democratic party primaries go as expected today. I might have to choose between Hillary and Obama. Since neither lines up more directly than the other with my politics, I'll probably end up choosing based solely on electability.

For now, I think Obama is more electable. He seems to wear well with the electorate (the more time he can spend with a group of voters, the more his poll numbers go up) and he doesn't inspire the rabid, frothing-at-the-mouth opposition that Hillary does. It annoys me greatly that the latter is a concern but I'm nervous about running Hillary. I really, really, really don't want another round of Republican presidents, their Supreme Court nominees, their judges, their handling of the economy, their profligate spending and graft, or their flavor of foreign policy.

Happily the Democrats have an amazing wealth of talent. I'd have preferred to vote closer to my morals and had the chance to vote for Kucinich but he has withdrawn. I think Obama would make an excellent Democratic president so, as much as it annoys me that I have to consider the unreasoning and unrelenting hate of the talk radio/right winger branch of the opposition in my vote, it isn't as if I'm having to choose someone I have serious reservations about.

I know a lot of people said they were turned off by the way the two campaigns went at each others' throats in South Carolina but I'm one of those voters who wants to see some toughness in a candidate. I don't ever want to send out a candidate against the Republican machine who refuses to fight or correct gross mischaracterizations. I *liked* seeing Obama stand up for himself. He challenged the much liked former president when he got it wrong. I don't want another guy who will stand for president rather than run. I don't want another Swiftboat election.

I'm still livid at Bill Clinton for injecting race as an issue -- and incredibly disappointed in him -- but I'm glad Obama got the chance to show me the stuff he's made of as a candidate.
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tejas[identity profile] tejas.livejournal.com on February 5th, 2008 07:35 pm (UTC)
To be honest, given Bill Clinton's political genius, ya gotta wonder if that was calculated. Not quite sure what his motive might be, except that he might not think Hillary Clinton is electable in the grand scheme of things.

Or he just screwed up. ;-)

I, too, would have preferred Kucinich or at least Edwards. Clinton and Obama are both far to conservative for my tastes, but I could vote for either one without feeling like I'm grossly violating my principles.

Of the two, I'd rather see Clinton stay in the Senate... and I agree with you on her electability. I fear Rethugs who might stay home if Obama was our candidate might move heaven and earth to get to the polls to vote against Clinton.
Mish[identity profile] hsapiens.livejournal.com on February 5th, 2008 07:58 pm (UTC)
I totally could not figure out why Bill Clinton pulled that shit. It made no sense in terms of what I've come to expect from him. It was not only wrong, I think it stands a good chance of hurting the Dems should Hillary be the nominee.

I'm with you in that both Clinton and Obama are too conservative for me but neither pings a political distress alarm for me. It's just weird to consider the possibility that my vote might actually count for something. The candidates might have to come to town and ask for my vote. Huh.
tejas[identity profile] tejas.livejournal.com on February 5th, 2008 08:04 pm (UTC)
Exactly. It's very weird. And ya know, given where you and I live, there's a decent possibility they might even be around our area some, liberal hotbed that it is. :-);-)

Hey... you interested in working on a campaign? I was just thinking I might be up for it. I worked on my now-state reps campaign and it was fun. (Who knew there were all those Democrats over in West U!)
Mish[identity profile] hsapiens.livejournal.com on February 5th, 2008 08:19 pm (UTC)
I'm almost giddy at the prospect of my vote counting for something. :)

I'm never adverse to helping a campaign I believe in, though I won't ever do phone calls because I hate talking on the phone. What campaigns do you have in mind?
tejas[identity profile] tejas.livejournal.com on February 5th, 2008 08:23 pm (UTC)
I've never done anything for a presidential campaign. I was thinking of trying to hook up with the Obama camp and see what they needed. I'm not interested in phone calls, either. I helped do yard signs for Ellen Cohen and that was great.

After the candidates have been chosen, I figure I'd try to do the same for the regular election, regardless of who the democratic candidate is.
Mish[identity profile] hsapiens.livejournal.com on February 5th, 2008 08:33 pm (UTC)
I haven't volunteered for a presidential campaign since Dukakis** -- this could be fun! I wouldn't mind joining the Obama campaign at all. Being in a red state, I've limited myself more to local elections where there's a real possibility of affecting change. Since my November vote won't count, maybe I can own a part of the process by volunteering in the campaign.

**I've been voting against "George Bush" since I came of age politically.
tejas[identity profile] tejas.livejournal.com on February 5th, 2008 08:41 pm (UTC)
I voted against Reagan first, but yeah, I've voted against Bush every single time I've seen his name on a ballot.
Mish[identity profile] hsapiens.livejournal.com on February 5th, 2008 08:57 pm (UTC)
Sadly, I was born too late to get to vote against Reagan. But I was there in spirit!
tejas[identity profile] tejas.livejournal.com on February 5th, 2008 08:59 pm (UTC)
LOL! I was taking government at UH at the time. I still remember my prof deconstructing Reagan's campaign in class. It was highly educational to see the house of cards *he* was standing on. Bush's is even more transparent.
Mish[identity profile] hsapiens.livejournal.com on February 5th, 2008 11:34 pm (UTC)
Man, I wish I'd had that class. It sounds like a good one.

Listening to people talk about voting for Bush in 2004 because he was such a good leader made me feel like I was from Venus.
tejas[identity profile] tejas.livejournal.com on February 5th, 2008 11:42 pm (UTC)
I kept TELLING them what an empty suit he was, but no one would listen!

I must have reread "The Marching Morons" a dozen times during that election cycle. It was so fitting.
Mish[identity profile] hsapiens.livejournal.com on February 6th, 2008 03:29 am (UTC)
I haven't read that. I made the mistake of reading Molly Ivins's book on Shrub prior to the national election and I found it just made it all the more depressing when his homies stole the election for him. :|
tejas[identity profile] tejas.livejournal.com on February 6th, 2008 04:07 am (UTC)
Yep.

I miss Miz Molly.
Mish[identity profile] hsapiens.livejournal.com on February 6th, 2008 04:24 am (UTC)
I really miss Molly and Ann. They were the bright spots of being Texan.
tejas[identity profile] tejas.livejournal.com on February 6th, 2008 04:28 am (UTC)
Talk about a dream team. :-)

Yeah, we need 'em now.
superbadgirl: God's work[personal profile] superbadgirl on February 5th, 2008 07:43 pm (UTC)
I usually end up hating both of the final "big two" candidates by the end of any given campaign, regardless of party.

But I'm moving to Canada for real this time if my fellow contemporary yokels elect Huckabee (if he ends up being the Rep. candidate, that is).

Edited 2008-02-05 07:51 pm (UTC)
Mish[identity profile] hsapiens.livejournal.com on February 5th, 2008 08:04 pm (UTC)
Oh yes, Huckabee scares me. Separation of Church and State is a fundamental, founding principle for our Constitution and it's one I cherish.

Our elections are nasty, aren't they? They don't reflect well on any of us: the candidates for behaving as they do, the media for failing to parse the campaigns and their attacks, or the electorate for falling for it. I keep my eye on the end - who it is I want choosing our bureaucracy heads and justices - and try to ignore a lot of what happens. I vote based on issues and the Republicans are so far from my beliefs that I have no hope of ever voting for one for president.

But yeah, the electoral process is very ugly.
superbadgirl[personal profile] superbadgirl on February 5th, 2008 08:18 pm (UTC)
Four years of Fuckabee (sorry, it's just so EASY) wouldn't really help the good US of A, IMO. My parents probably love him. I refuse to talk politics with them, because it just boggles my mind that they vote Republican.

Mish[identity profile] hsapiens.livejournal.com on February 5th, 2008 08:25 pm (UTC)
I was registered to vote at 12:01 a.m. on my 18th birthday by my mother, who was Republican precinct chairman at the time. She still votes Republican despite being pro-choice and socially liberal -- at least in the Republican sense of it. I cannot begin to fathom why.

The weirdest thing has been watching my very militaristic, very Republican step-father (former Air Force officer) morph into a global warming expert and passionate advocate for conservation.

I haven't generally discuss politics with them, either, although I'm coming to have more in common with him than with her. That is extremely odd for me.
tejas[identity profile] tejas.livejournal.com on February 5th, 2008 07:51 pm (UTC)
Huckabee won in the West Virginia convention.

I'm almost sorry he doesn't stand a chance of getting the Republican nomination because his being on their side of the ballot would mean we could run Jiminy Cricket and win. ;-):-)
Mish[identity profile] hsapiens.livejournal.com on February 5th, 2008 08:08 pm (UTC)
Huckabee is the right wing's Ralph Nader. So long as he and Mitt split the right wing of his party, they have no chance of beating McCain.

I wish I could agree with you but we're talking about a country that re-elected Bush so I have no faith that people would run from him.
tejas[identity profile] tejas.livejournal.com on February 5th, 2008 08:11 pm (UTC)
Well, there is that.

The only good thing about it is that he apparently even scares the rabid evangelicals (as opposed to the normal folks who happen to be evangelicals).
Mish[identity profile] hsapiens.livejournal.com on February 5th, 2008 08:36 pm (UTC)
I had no idea. I have to admit that I pay scant attention to the Republican primaries because I know there's no chance I'd vote for one in the general election. I did watch a piece of the last Repub debate and found it scary that Ron Paul was the only one making a bit of sense. I can see why people who otherwise identify as conservative have been supporting him with donations.

In the meantime, I hope the Dems are storing up clips of these guys fighting to see who can stay in Iraq the longest.
[identity profile] juneprota.livejournal.com on February 5th, 2008 10:31 pm (UTC)
YAY OBAMA!!!!!
Mish[identity profile] hsapiens.livejournal.com on February 5th, 2008 11:39 pm (UTC)
:) Nine months and counting...November can't come soon enough for me.
[identity profile] roundrockronin.livejournal.com on February 5th, 2008 11:50 pm (UTC)
Have you had a look at Ron Paul, seriously? Yes, I am biased, but he his certainly very different from the other Republicans that are running.
Mish[identity profile] hsapiens.livejournal.com on February 6th, 2008 12:35 am (UTC)
I get this far:

http://www.ronpaul2008.com/issues/life-and-liberty/

and know that this is not the candidate for me. My fundamental issue is *always* respect for other people's rights to control their bodies. Consenting adults should be in charge of themselves. A lot of other issues I consider important grow out of whether or not a person owns his own body. It's a fundamental philosophy as far as I'm concerned and it's essentially why I don't spend much time listening to Republicans.

I also disagree with his take on many economic issues. I support his stance to cut spending and to stop throwing away money, but we tend to define "throwing away" in different ways. Of all the Republicans in the debate I watched, he made the most sense on some issues. I find him a breath of fresh air in some ways -- his appeal to returning to our Constitution when it comes to declaring war is in line with mine -- but on too many issues that are non-negotiable to me his philosophy isn't something I can vote for.
[identity profile] memento1.livejournal.com on February 6th, 2008 03:44 am (UTC)
I voted Hillary. Whatever. I like her policies. I like her. But I'm not adverse to Obama. Personally, I'd love to see a Clinton/Obama ticket, either way.

And I totally missed out on this Bill and racism issue, whatever it is, and I'm glad I did.
Mish[identity profile] hsapiens.livejournal.com on February 6th, 2008 04:12 am (UTC)
Yay for voting!!

I'm not adverse to either Clinton or Obama. I like both Dems equally and I'd really like to see both of them on the same ticket, too. As of tonight, it looks like McCain might have trouble getting the Repub base to the polls in November and I fear that Hillary might because some of those folks are frothy *insane.* :)

I'm going to be happy no matter who wins.

Missing Bill's idiocy was lucky. He only cheapened the dialog and did nobody a service.