Yeah, when I first became vegan, there were a lot of honey debates (at least that I remember), but I think that now it's generally agreed that honey is not vegan. Bee keepers are not all that kind to the bees and many bees are killed in the making of it. Also...the way the honey is made does have some kinds of bee ick in it, according to vegans, though I can't say I actually even know how the honey is made. *g*

Then again? It could be my sweet tooth talking. ;-)

Exactly.

I actually kind of resent the way that Real!Vegans have co-opted the "vegan" term to mean an entire lifestyle like "Amish" or something. To me it's another form of a vegetarian diet. At the same time, I understand the feelings about people claiming to be vegan if they don't do everything exactly like how it seems to be generally accepted now. Like "vegetarians" who eat chicken or fish. *g*

I haven't eliminated all animal products from my life nor am I likely to. I do what I can, but I'm not obsessive about that part of. Ingesting any type of animal product (other than honey *g*)? Yes, I'm obsessive and nitpicky about that.